So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

About SheepShaver, a PPC Mac emulator for Windows, MacOS X, and Linux that can run System 7.5.3 to MacOS 9.0.4.

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CorporalPig22
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So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by CorporalPig22 »

So far, I've tried Bugdom, but it says there's no 3D accelerator card even though I set the render driver to Direct3D (I'm using the Windows build). What 3D-accelerated games have you guys been able to run on SS so far?
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by adespoton »

CorporalPig22 wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:02 pm So far, I've tried Bugdom, but it says there's no 3D accelerator card even though I set the render driver to Direct3D (I'm using the Windows build). What 3D-accelerated games have you guys been able to run on SS so far?
As we discussed in the announcement thread, the change doesn't present hardware acceleration to the OS inside SheepShaver; the change allows SheepShaver itself to be hardware accelerated. So any graphics work that SheepShaver used to struggle with should now be relatively zippy and not bog down the general emulation loop.

That said, Bugdom and the other Pangaea games don't actually require the accelerator card; they'll run in QEMU-PPC; they just require specific information to be present for the game engine to realize there's no accelerator and run the game engine's emulated accelerator (with the performance loss that entails).
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by matO_opp_ITA »

Hi, I've tried too to run bugdom under SheepShaver WITH ATI 3D Accelerator drivers extensions but I have the same problem.
This is my configuration of SheepShaver:


disk C:\Users\matOo\Desktop\SheepShaver-Windows-16-05-2021\Macintosh HD
extfs
screen dga/0/0
windowmodes 3
screenmodes 63
seriala COM1
serialb COM2
rom C:\Users\matOo\Desktop\SheepShaver-Windows-16-05-2021\1998-07-21 - Mac OS ROM 1.1.rom
bootdrive 0
bootdriver 0
ramsize 268435456
frameskip 1
gfxaccel true
nocdrom true
nonet false
nosound false
nogui false
noclipconversion false
ignoresegv true
ignoreillegal false
jit true
jit68k false
keyboardtype 5
hardcursor false
hotkey 0
scale_nearest false
scale_integer false
cpuclock 233
yearofs 0
dayofs 0
mag_rate 0
swap_opt_cmd true
sound_buffer 0
name_encoding 0
ether slirp
keycodes false
keycodefile C:\Users\matOo\Desktop\SheepShaver-Windows-16-05-2021\BasiliskII_keycodes
mousewheelmode 1
mousewheellines 3
idlewait false
keycodes false
keycodefile C:\Users\matOo\Desktop\SheepShaver-Windows-16-05-2021\BasiliskII_keycodes
mousewheelmode 1
mousewheellines 3
enableextfs true
debugextfs false
extdrives C
pollmedia true
etherpermanentaddress true
ethermulticastmode 0
routerenabled false
ftp_port_list 21
portfile0 C:\B2TEMP0.OUT
portfile1 C:\B2TEMP1.OUT
Last edited by matO_opp_ITA on Thu Jul 15, 2021 5:59 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by adespoton »

The hardware acceleration feature is to accelerate SheepShaver the emulator; it's not a GPU passthrough to the software inside. Enabling it will make screen redrawing faster with less CPU churn, because SheepShaver will be able to use the GPU to draw the screen instead of doing it all via CPU.

Bugdom will still have the same issues either way.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by matO_opp_ITA »

Soo, what we need to do for add 3D acceleration to SheepShaver?
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by adespoton »

Someone who is familiar with the cebix source code, familiar with driver software development, and who has access to ATi Rage 128 specs, plus has the time and inclination to put it all together. Plus, they have to be someone who isn't already working on adding hardware acceleration to QEMU-PPC.

It's not likely to happen.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by almeath »

Is this new hardware acceleration feature going to be for Windows only? I can’t see any reference to it in the MacOS version of SheepShaver.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by Ronald P. Regensburg »

As far as I am aware, this is Windows-only. On OSX/macOS, BasiliskII and SheepShaver use OpenGL or Metal depending on the hosts hardware.

Note that this feature is about rendering used by the emulator on the host. It does not do anything for software running inside the emulator. It does not change anything for 3D games.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by almeath »

Ronald P. Regensburg wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 7:23 am As far as I am aware, this is Windows-only. On OSX/macOS, BasiliskII and SheepShaver use OpenGL or Metal depending on the hosts hardware.

Note that this feature is about rendering used by the emulator on the host. It does not do anything for software running inside the emulator. It does not change anything for 3D games.
Thanks, I do understand the distinction between the acceleration on the host hardware and pass through for emulation of older accelerators within the classic macOS. I was primarily interested to see if it would have any impact on games that need maximum emulation speed (i.e. the 3D shooters like Dark Forces) but from what you are saying, the macOS version should already have this feature via its existing OpenGL/Metal support? Is this new feature just giving the Windows version parity in performance?
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by Ronald P. Regensburg »

As I understand it, it gives a choice in the GUI for optimal SDL rendering with different graphical hardware on the host. In OSX/macOS the emulators automatically use Metal if available and OpenGL if Metal is not available.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by almeath »

That makes sense, thanks. Good to know the Mac version is already taking full advantage of what the GPU can do to assist with overall performance.
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by matO_opp_ITA »

So for use 3D accelerated games we need OpenGL on the emulated MacOS?
Or something else?
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by Cat_7 »

Inside the emulated MacOS 9 sometimes installing opengl (if not installed already) or other drivers can convince some games to run. But there will be no real acceleration available. All graphics calculations will be done in software which is slow as emulation processor costs are high.

To have real acceleration you would have to reroute the calls the MacOS does to emulated hardware to real hardware on the host.
So if you want to use the modern graphics card in your host while the guest sees the old card, software needs to be written that can reroute/translate the calls to the hardware on the host. But documentation is no always available on how old graphics cards actually work while there can many different cards in the hosts.

An alternative approach is to use a real old graphics card and make the emulator see and use it. But then it would need to fit in your host, as interfaces have changed over time. In old Macs you might find Nubus, PCI, AGP etc. ports not available in new hardware.

AFAIK no one has ever finished work on any of the two options.
There have been some recent attempts using Qemu, but those are also not finished or partly abandoned.

Best,
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Re: So, what 3D games are compatible with the new hardware acceleration feature?

Post by matO_opp_ITA »

Ok, I try to install OpenGL and I see if run
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